Wake up, Buy Here, Pay Here people. It's a beautiful day. Go grab yourself another cup of Joe and say hello to Jim and Michelle Rhodes on the Buy Here, Pay Here morning show. Take it away, you two. Good morning. I need to put us into the stream. It's Monday. Hey. Yeah. It's been a little choppy over here. It has been, but it's good. It's good. Happy to be here. We were going through and reading some different articles on our subject today, just making sure that we had... a little bit of non-attorney know-how, but we can talk about that in just a minute. Did you not, today not April Fool's Day? It is! Happy April Fool's for anyone that does April Fool's. It's actually, the funny thing is, is my younger brother, is celebrating his 20th wedding anniversary today. And so they got married on April Fool's in Vegas. And then, yeah, so. Do we know if they're really even married? I hope. Well, you know, I'm pretty sure. I'm pretty sure that they are. But so happy anniversary to my brother and his lovely, my brother John and his lovely wife, Holly. And they, yeah, we had dinner at their house last night and they're just amazing, amazing people. So, yeah. What announcements do we have? We have a lot. I didn't bring the actual calendar. All of our meetings are set for V8. We do have a couple of spots available for... Yeah, so we've got Group 4. Actually, I can remember. Group 4 is the one that meets on the 16th. That's the one that's 100 to 500 dealers. We've got seats available on that one. Yeah, so mid-sized. And then the end of the month, we have group three. That's the newcomer group. And that one meets on the 30th. So there's plenty of time for folks to. And in the meantime, just make sure you capture your notes, receivable numbers and your inventory numbers. And then let's get together. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So let us know if that's something that you are looking to do. uh coming up uh one of the reasons why the the new group is meeting at the very end of the month is because the week before we will be in vegas um and we'll be doing the neo user summit and then we have meetings with a lot of our um people from our sponsors and um our ceo and others uh talking about what it is that we're going to be doing for this next year so yeah that's uh did you say the date the neo user summer is on tuesday the 23rd we have a number of our clients that are going to be there and learning about the latest with neo and uh I got to get back out to the neo user group and do an update we have yes I put that post out there in their user group about a client that was having a conflict in the interest of trying to help all dealers who were maybe facing the same thing we put it out there in the group and now We have a resolution. And so I need to chase down the people who can kind of speak to the specifics. I wasn't involved in the technical meetings. And so I need to make sure I understand exactly what the result was so that I can help clear that up. So thank you to Neo to, you know, helping get that resolved. And it wasn't really anything on their side. So at least that we've, yeah. So we appreciate their help in getting that resolved. So is our client. As does our clients. Yes, absolutely. So that's getting fixed. And that was all. And it's all it's learning, you know, it's like, well, this this isn't working. So why is it not working? And then, you know, being able to do that in a public forum so that other people can learn from that if you if you find the same kind of stuff happening that you can. And I shared in a different post in our, we talked about in our podcast, you know, sometimes, sometimes, and this has not happened with Neo, but it's like, often it's like, you know, it's these people. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's not us. It's not us. It's them. It's not us. It's not us. It's them. Anyway, there's a resolution. And as she said, Neo, um, neo was doing their part it just somebody was leaving some steps out and it wasn't all of the the tracking information from ad campaigns was not making it into neo which is an important way for us to analyze you know results absolutely absolutely applicants with campaigns etc etc so all good now there's a lot of progress on that and I think that's probably it from my side uh Oh, Dealer Roundup coming up on the 18th. Brent Carmichael will be co-moderating with Jim. We have our three subjects. The subjects, I don't know that we have the titles completely nailed down, but it's going to be on outside private capital for funding your buy here, pay here, outsourcing, And the other one's going to be car using, hiring car people. We called it like some of the old car dogs. But then the other one was outsourcing too. Yeah. So it's about hiring car dogs for, you know, that everybody's for buy here, pay here. People that are experienced car salespeople do. Can it work? Can buy here, pay here? Why or why not? So we will have that conversation with Brent Carmichael and a few dealers. I'll be reaching out to dealers this week. Yeah, if any of those subjects sound interesting to you and you feel like you've got a dog in the fight, let us know. Yeah. Because we're putting together the panels right now. Yeah. All right. We have a subject. Yeah. And, yeah. This is one that sounds like you're turning it over to me. No. Jim? Yes. Yeah, so we've touched on similar subjects in the past, and this one we haven't really addressed specifically. And I'm glad we brought it up because in our own, kind of my own research this morning in preparing for the broadcast, I learned that some of the terminology I'm using is not accurate, right? So should I put that thing up? yeah well yeah that's good I mean that's fine we can cover that piece first so let's talk about re so I put the poll out and success and you might help me to locate and let's see the latest information on that but the um the thing I want to learn about that is We put a poll out that basically says, do you allow your customers to redeem after repossession? So it was just short answered like yes, no, or sometimes depending. Most everybody was sometimes depending when I was looking at it. And this is why it's so important for us to revisit this thing about redemption versus reinstatement. Because I've been using the word redemption to redeem a repo for my whole career. So I picked that up somewhere. And now in reading some of the material... Yeah, Capital One, I read an article this morning where they were talking about redemption and, you know, versus reinstatement. And then we were like, oh, okay. So, and I don't, maybe the rest of you understood the difference between the two as well. But when they were talking about redemption, it was about you can get your car back if you pay it off. Yeah. So let's clear that up. And so I have the same thing. I read an article from Credit Karma and they use some of the same phrasing. So let's let's first clear that up. Like when we talk about redemption, that's the customer coming in paying off. So when when we use the phrasing and this is my own mistake, like when I put out the poll, do you allow the customer to. you know, redeem the car. Well, under the definition of redemption, we would have to let you give the car back to them because that's the customer paying it off. That's, that's prior to a sale. They have to act in a certain time period. Well, and also what they, what the, one of the things that I read talks about is that there are, each state has different laws around this and some states require a loan to have the option to redeem with an, and you know, that. Redeem or reinstate. to redeem a redemption um that that that so check with your local laws because it was about you you know they have you have to send out something that says hey you have x amount of days I said between 10 and 15 days to redeem pay this off this is what you owe And they can come and buy it because it's going to auction. And so if you can pay for it by this date, then it won't be going to auction. If not, it's going to auction. Again, check your laws. Check your laws. Because your state may be different. And so that's what we talked about bringing an attorney back to this conversation. I think the challenge will still be, even if you had an attorney here, the answer is going to be it depends a lot. Like you're almost going to need to talk to your attorney. attorney and get familiar with your regulations and your state and even some jurisdictional stuff I learned in the past. But just be cautious and know that there are very specific rules around this. So when we talk about creating a policy, you know that we want to be tough and we want to have our own policy. Just understand there are very much rules. There's UCC regulations in place, Uniform Commercial Code. There's a lot of stuff that protects, you know, creditors. And this is not new. This has been around for decades. And so this is stuff that is meant to, in some states, there's certain requirements on a post. So let me just walk you through it, Michelle, since you haven't, you know, been a dealer and haven't been through this. I'm married into buy here, pay here. Yeah, I learn every day. Yeah. So the thing that happens in a repossession situation, and again, this part varies by state as well. Some states are required to notify the customer in advance of their intention to repo if the customer doesn't satisfy any delinquency. So there's some states that require that, but not all states. And then at the time of repossession, We're expected, and this is the part I'm not an attorney, so I can speak to my own experience in my own state as a dealer from before. But really, you would want to check and make sure about your obligation to notify the customer once the car has been repossessed. So there's a curing period, typically. It's an opportunity for the customer to... cure the default to resolve the deficiency to, you know, otherwise resolve the matter. And so that requirement, so typically this, the form is available in the, in the, in the DMS. But when I say redemption, that was my own language. Like you'd have to go back and see what the language is, you know, and again, with most, this is where DMS is can help a lot because the DMS is typically going to have the necessary documents in your state. Um, So this is part of where we can lean on them for some of that and obviously talk to your state association. But I think the key thing is once we serve notice to the customer that, and by the way, we have a podcast from the past. I think you can just search personal belongings. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. We did a, that's kind of a separate subject. But, you know, we would notify the customer that we've repossessed the car and that they have an opportunity to have a window of time to resolve the matter or the car will be sold. And so now this is why the question comes up about redemption versus reinstatement. So reinstatement would be really what I should have asked in the poll about do you allow the customer to get the car back without paying the account in full? Obviously, if they come in and pay the account in full, they're getting the car back if you haven't sold it. Yeah. And the things that I was reading is that there's, you know, there's a lot that I didn't see that there was like any kind of statute that says this is how you have to do a reinstatement if you choose to do reinstatement. But there were a lot of options. They were talking about, you know, just getting it current, paying off, you know, whatever towing fees and lot fees. or re-establishing the loan and re-amortizing and so and and decreasing I mean if the reason why that they've repoed is because they couldn't afford the payment then it's a it's it's an opportunity to re-establish the loan to re-amortize this is tricky because now you get into a scenario where I'm not sure that buy here pay here on a retail installment contract has the same latitude that a lender might as a finance company in refinancing, re-amortizing the note. So again, one more reason to talk to an attorney and make sure what you're able to do. Most dealers are not lowering payments for customers in the interest of a redemption. They may if it's permitted. But I think the part that I was trying to get to is that we see through social media especially people talking about how they handle repo reinstatements as it turns out can can the customer can get the car back under these circumstances and I think for this morning I just wanted to caution everybody and say check your check with an attorney because I'm hearing some things that are unlawful based on my own understanding which is which is not your state it's just based on many years of travels across many states and kind of seeing the practice but you know it's typical that your, your customer is going to be expected to catch up any past due payments, right? If they're, you know, behind two payments of $400, they're going to have to have that money. They're going to have, you know, any late fees, probably they're going to have any, any repossession fee that you've incurred. Now be careful about that one because I have heard plenty of attorneys say you're really treading on thin ice. If you're charging your customer based on your own cost of a repossession, if you're doing it yourself, um, And you try to charge the customer $500 for repossession. That's really tricky legal territory. So, again, not an attorney. I'm just saying that ask your attorney because this gets tricky. Would it have to be like real costs kind of thing? That's cut and dry. Like if you certainly can recover your direct costs. And, you know, there have been times I can tell you as a dealer. you know I just I try not to get too black and white on much of anything I always try to leave myself some some wiggle room in a policy and so for example when you say the customer has got to catch up the past due and has got to pay the repossession fee or whatever else the the policy might be then I can just tell you there have been situations in in my own career as a dealer where I allowed the customer back in the car without them having to fulfill all those things and so It's that's where that subjectivity thing comes in. I mean, it could be, you know, let's say someone doesn't make the payment because they had some major catastrophic thing that happened in their life. And it's like, I couldn't I couldn't do this. But, you know, you know, they've been a great payer before something happened. And the nature of our business, frankly, is that you have and I can't believe Michelle didn't smile when I use the word frankly, because. Sorry. Yeah. He's like, who is that? And why should we use that word, frankly? Oh, he gives me grief about so much stuff. It's so funny. Frankly, and I'll ask her, now, was that really frank? Are you sure frankly was, you know, I'll just give it a hard time. Anyway, so I think one of the things that happens here is that, you know, when you get in a situation where the customer is, in that place like you you want to be able to do whatever makes sense for you as the dealer creditor because um I understand what's legally um expected and what you know I might I might be able to require the customer to do but I just know that as a dealer it's necessary on occasion um, to repossess as a matter of enforcement. So imagine you've got a customer who's newer in the contract and they haven't financed with you in the past. They, all their experience in collections and this sort of thing is with other creditors, if at all. Um, and they simply don't know they don't you know communicate well enough they didn't hear what was said we haven't expressed this part very clearly like most of us don't say to the customer at the time of closing if you haven't made your payment by the 15th day we will be repossessing the car most of us don't say that yeah nor am I advocating for that I'm simply saying when the customer is in that situation Sometimes it's necessary to repossess. Customer's not communicating, we're not hearing from them, and so it becomes necessary to repossess. However, that's done more as a matter of enforcement. It's always, as a dealer myself, let me just speak for me. If I'm the dealer, it's my hope and expectation to a degree that when... We repossess a customer's car that we're going to find a way to resolve the matter. So one other quick thing that I don't think I shared this when we talked about repo belongings before, but one of the things that I would do as a matter of. Meeting with the customer. So this is kind of the tips, tips that I can recommend as a non-attorney. Um, if a customer wanted to meet, you know, called in and said, Hey, you guys repossessed my car. I really would like to try to get that worked out. And I would, you know, I'd set up a time to have them come meet with me and I would just listen, you know, and I, I. I can say that it's easier to have that conversation with the customer when we're in possession of the car. It's in a secure area. We have our set of keys. We don't yet have the customer set of keys, perhaps. But but the collateral is now in our possession. And so now it puts us in a difficult position. And I was never smug about it. When I would meet with a customer, I would give them the opportunity to tell their story, explain what happened. And so we'll just kind of say, your account got really past due and we didn't hear from you. So talk to me about what's going on. How come we didn't hear from you on these payments? And then just be quiet and listen. But before I would do that even, I think this is the part that... Is because we have an obligation, like a legal obligation to serve them notice. Okay. So, so back to this notice of intent to sell the collateral. Okay. If I were to meet with a customer, we repossessed in the morning and we're going to meet with the customer at two o'clock in the afternoon, then I would have all the documents prepared. Okay. so that they're ready for signing. So when the customer comes in, they're going to start talking about the car and the payments and this and that. I've said, let's give this a minute. I'm happy to meet with you and talk about this. But before we do all that, here's a couple of things I need from you. I need you to review this document and sign it. I need you to give me the keys to the car. Of course, when I asked for the keys to the car, They're going to get upset, and they're going to say, well, I thought we were going to meet and try to work this out. Like, I'm hoping to get the car back. And I would typically just take the position, look, I'm happy to hear what happened there, and maybe we'll get it worked out. In the meantime, I need to get the keys to the car. And so I would just stand there and wait patiently. And they're upset, you know, and I understand they're upset. It's a frustrating situation. Yeah. Well, and I can imagine the emotion tied around those keys because it's their last connection to getting the car back. Yeah. And I'm going to just tell them, look, I'm going to listen. We're going to try to get it worked out. I'm going to hear what you have to say. But I just am not, you know, we're not going to have that conversation until I've got the keys to the car back. So it's really a posturing thing if you want to use that language. But it was also crossing some legal ground for me. Like I would have the customer sign. Because the notification is the same whether they reinstate or not. So I'm still going to have them sign the notification. This says that you understand that we're going to sell the car by this date if we haven't reached a resolution. And now they've signed it in person. I can make a photocopy as opposed to mailing it certified mail that came in in person on the day of, whatever the day after. And so we would typically be the day of because by the next day, we would have already mailed the certification. Now, I still would probably have the customer sign because I'm just just trying to make sure that I'm super clear about I have served the customer the appropriate notices. And now I can just listen. Right now, it's all it's all buttoned up legally. It's all ready to move forward if we don't reach a resolution and a reinstatement. And I just hear what they have to say. And of course, now they're in a much different position, like both legally. Right. And just kind of. You might call it energetically, like it's a whole different environment now. And now I can listen. I can just sit back and listen and hear what they had to say. And at the end, I may be satisfied with the story. Yeah. Well, you know, and one thing that I know about Jim is Jim has the skill naturally to listen. And that is for a lot. I mean, it's easy for when someone comes in, it's like you lead the conversation. It's like you're driving the conversation. So I need you to sign this. I need you to sign this. And that's an easy thing for you as the dealer or for someone that's working the desk for that kind of transaction to just like, let's just go right in and you take control of the conversation. Because I know from having um from having been a uh having my own teams and managing my own teams it's kind of like firing someone you know so you get in there and you like lead the conversation this is what needs to happen and then you step into the listening part and that is a skill that takes some bit of practice uh if you don't normally have it because Most people feel uncomfortable with silence and so they will just start to fill it. But you just want to make sure that the customer is the one that's filling the silence, not you. And so be quiet and let them fill the silence because they will fill the silence. If you're quiet long enough, they will fill it. And then you can just add whatever little things to kind of keep the conversation going. moving so that they're the ones that are filling the silence, give them a proper amount of time to explain what it is that's happened, ask the appropriate questions and then make your decision. But also imagine, you know, it's kind of back to the subjectivity thing about attitude matters. Oh, yeah. Like if the customer is still agitated and angry and doesn't seem to show any real remorse or you don't feel like they've learned anything, then of course, I don't feel like I want to proceed. That's totally fair, but it's also in what kind of attitude are you bringing to this? I'm so exasperated with you. I'm barely even listening. Can we just get through this? What kind of energy are you bringing to the conversation? Because people can pick up on that. It's like when you're on the phone, people that are that do mostly phones, whether it be BDC or collections, put a fricking mirror in front of them and say, look at your face when you're talking, because that, that is a good, you know, inflections and all of that will carry through. So, you know, especially if you're, if you're doing something like this, it's they, you know, you can pick up an awful lot about the energy coming from the person that, that is leading this conversation. Yeah. And I think if you go back and try to imagine, of course, it's easier for you to imagine because you know me and see me do similar things. But it's like if you if you imagine the customer comes in and my my tone of voice is one of, you know, I'm going to I'm going to meet with you. I need to get the keys to the car. And of course, that's naturally going to potentially upset them. Right. At least for a moment. And so I'm going to say I'm going to try to reassure them. Look. I'm going to, we're going to meet and we're going to try to get this worked out, but I just got to cover this legal ground first. I need to get the keys to the car. I'm going to need you to review and sign these. And I didn't mention, I would also be having them sign their belongings list because if they do get upset. Which is that other website or that other podcast. Yeah. So it's like, I've got all those things, those T's crossed. And now I can just sit and listen. And now I really can. I'm in a, I'm in a great position and I'm able to just sit and I, and I'm really just listening out of curiosity. Like I'm just confused about how we found ourselves in this place and I need to understand what happened. And so now I can just, I can just listen. I can take the documents that are signed. I can get them a copy. I can put mine back aside and just say, okay, now tell me what happened. And you know, how can we didn't hear from you? and just let them explain. And like I said, a lot of times there's a satisfactory explanation. It's just a matter of hearing the, know what went on and again many of the customers that we're serving um just aren't familiar with the process they didn't realize that they could face repossession in that situation because again we're our policies are different than where they finance somewhere else and so they don't they can't know what our policies are going to be and how that's going to happen but I think what we what I always wanted to make sure is that you know when we ever ordered a repossession. We were in safe legal grounds. We had plenty of, so it was more than legal. It was like, we not only had the customer defaulted, but we had ample record to substantiate the fact that we had made every reasonable effort to try to contact them, you know, whatever was, you know, Which is great for if you've got a great CRM. Yeah, I just documented really most of that happened in the DMS on the account side. So it's like you're just logging all the stuff, all the effort to try to contact the customer. Now we take the repossession action because we've done everything reasonable to try to communicate with them. And now... Again, I'm just going to sit and listen. It's my hope that, and I don't have the data on it. I don't know if anybody's really got good data on repo reinstatement. Like of the customers that we allow to reinstate, what's the success rate with that? I bet you there's a lot of theories out there. I just don't know that anybody's really tracked the data correctly. So it's like I would be interested to know, at least anecdotally, I'd like to be able to hear from people about you know when you do allow a customer redeem you know what's the what's the success rate and I can say that you know my feeling anecdotally was that we probably half of the customers anecdotally yeah okay Frankly, I think it's just kind of my my best recollection on that is probably roughly half of the customers, you know, understood, moved on, communicated in a way that they could avoid repossession in the future. And but the other. Well, and that's also, you know, it's in your policy or whatever is if we've already been through this once, there's there may not be a conversation at all. and it's just like here's your where's your keys here's the thing sign the stuff and that that was my and it's only a curing of the of the loan that was my practice I kind of used the phrasing in another conversation recently about the the on our podcast about radius last week yeah it's like you know you kind of take this position where You know, I've even used the phrase like, you know, this isn't baseball. You don't get three strikes. So once, you know, if you have a strike, then just know that this is we've got to make sure we understand one another, that we're able to communicate well and that we avoid finding ourselves in that place. And I would typically use phrasing along the line of if because we find it necessary to repossess again, you may not get the car back. Now, let me just say, legally, I don't know if I do repossess a car a second time. This is where you folks need to just check with your attorney because if you do repossess a second time and the customer shows up and it meets the conditions for reinstatement, are you required by law to give the car back to them? I don't know. And that's a great question. But the things that I was reading is that there, there are laws surrounding redemption, but not around reinstatement. I don't think redemption would be more straightforward because customers got the full cash. Yeah. And so it's like, yeah, if you want to come in and buy it, great. You know, you've, you've got your car back, but I, we're done having a conversation about reinstatement. Yeah. Yeah. I'm no longer your finance source for payments, you know? yeah so you know I i want to before we sign off just um you know uh well recap but also um most of the time from my perspective and you tell me if I'm like way off base oh of course that when you when I know you will sometimes when you're watching us and you can just see the look on his face like what okay you're talking about is that um that reinstatement conversation is not going to be with a collector it's not going to be with the salesperson it's going to be with the dealer principal or the general manager it needs to be the person who has the decision and there's nowhere else for someone to go for the decision and you know that that's communicated So if and for most dealerships, that would be the dealer principle for most out there. There are some that are that are large enough that they've got multiple sites. And so it's a general manager and, you know, all of the collection. Yeah. So if you are the person that is responsible for that, for reinstatement is I would challenge you. Challenge. Challenge you to talk to someone that is one of your team members, maybe even your partner, and say, how good am I at empathetic listening? At listening. How good am I at empathetic listening? And what would you rate my skills for listening to be? Um, because you know, if you've got a good relationship with your partner or with your general manager or with your, you know, your collection, whatever, it's like, what would you rate? Cause I, I really want to know that I'm, I'm, I'm able to sit and listen because listening, um, even with salespeople is like some people got it and some people don't, they just lead the conversation and it's like, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. And they close, close, close, close, close, but they don't spend an awful lot of time listening. Um, Unless, well, listening with the intent to respond. There's a difference between listening for the intent to understand and listening for the intent to respond. And usually if you're listening with the intent to respond, you're already formulating your answer or your comeback or whatever to whatever it is saying. And so have this conversation with someone that you trust that you can say, how good am I at this? And if there's room to improve, then there's, there's lots of ways for you to practice that. Because one other piece that we can touch on, you know, I mentioned it could be a collection supervisor. I got to get a little water. I'm going to cough in the microphone, but the collection supervisor would be probably my last choice of somebody to do it. If I've got a general manager or business owner who really, this is really a business matter more than it is a collections matter. So the reason that's significant to me is that I, The collection supervisor has been overseeing this account. Perhaps there's a team, but they're much more likely to take it personally, and they're frustrated with the customer by the time a repossession is ordered. So naturally, their approach to the conversation is one of frustration. It's a bit personal, and their inclination is to not give the car back. And while that may be the right decision in the end, It's just tainted by a lot of emotion. And so it's like, this is why we think that it ought to be done by somebody who is in a better position, maybe present with so that we can understand the whole story. But really, let me just be the dealer for a minute. Take the collection supervisor out of the picture. I'm going to go to the notes. I'm going to read the history. I'm going to read the recent history since the customer became past due. What has happened? What kind of dialogue? Without the emotion. No emotion. I'm looking at the history. I'm looking at the log. What happened with this customer? Did they communicate? Did we communicate? Did we fulfill our part to notify the customer and give them ample opportunity to resolve the matter? Yeah. And I just want to see the whole picture and understand what happened. And now I can meet with the customer, hear their story. If I feel like they have learned something from the experience, they're remorseful, they still live here, they still have the same job, and they better understand what is required, then I may be prepared to move forward. And my collection supervisor might not be. And so this is something you have to be prepared to navigate. I think as a business owner, as a team leader, it's a good idea to hear from the collection manager through the notes, preferably if they... And that's where a CRM, a good CRM is... is important and it's part of your process that when it gets to this point, the collection, the person over it, maybe add some notes and then the person that's over them, the collection manager might add some notes as well so that you can go through and listen to I think that's from Hugo. So a Facebook user, and I'm assuming it's Hugo, says, please don't ask Amanda if I'm an empathetic listener. I wouldn't dream of it. If it's Hugo. I wouldn't dream of it, Facebook user. So it is this kind of conversation for redemption, for whatever, is best done without emotion. I'm going to throw one more for you before we wrap up on this subject. There's another reason that a dealer or general manager would want to be involved in this. A lot of times there's a financial element to this. So you're sitting here looking at a customer who wishes to redeem or I'm sorry, reinstate. And now- We have to change all of our vernacular. And now you're looking at the account balance on the customer's account and you're looking at the value of the collateral that has been repossessed. And you've got a financial consideration there that the collection supervisor has no perspective. And also, you know, the collateral is in your hands, so you can actually look at the condition of the collateral, too, as part of the conversation. But I'm just saying, the financial consideration is yet another one to decide, do I really want this car to go to auction and have this customer, you know, left in a position where... So again, I don't know if we're allowed to refinance or re-amortize in that situation, lower payments, but there could be moments where that's going to be an appropriate course of action. And I can say as a dealer myself, depending on the value of the collateral, if a customer paid the past due, and resume payments next, even if they never made another payment, if they made one or two more payments, you still financially might choose to do that. So they're just saying there's going to be times that the financial element, the actual numbers and the, the, The value of collateral is going to be a decision. And this is what we have in buy here, pay here. It's a little bit different if you're a lender, if you're Capital One and the repossession is off at some auction. And, you know, this is us. And that also depends on your business model. I mean, gosh, that's one thing about buy here, pay here that has been, it's really hard to have a hard and fast rule on anything. So it's like, what's your business model? What's your decision? How, you know, all of the things. But I mean, if it's a car that still has $20,000 left on it, that couldn't be a different conversation. Well, that's an interesting one because there's legal implications here. There are financial elements to consider. There's just simple... like enforcement of policy that is important. We have to be able to enforce that policy or it becomes meaningless, you know? And so this is all part of, you know, why this was a significant conversation, but I think we've, we've covered the pieces I want to cover. We can wrap up there. Okay. I'm trying to bring up some music cause you know, we have a new board and I just, we haven't programmed all the fun music left in it. So, you know, it's, techie tools techie toys hey thanks for tuning in yeah monday we'll see you thank you wednesday all right have a great rest of your week and thanks for sharing your morning
